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Topic: What Would You Have Done?, If you knew the Japanese were Coming< Next Oldest | Next Newest >
 Post Number: 21
Desertmole Search for posts by this member.

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PostIcon Posted on: Nov. 02 2008,6:57  Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

From what I've read over the years, it would take longer than 2 hours to get up steam and be away.  So the question is how much time?

If it were, say, 12 hours, I'd take the fleet to sea and send them South.  After that, work on arranging a rendezous with Halsey.  At least then you have some limited air cover.

I would launch every available PBY in a night attack.  They just might surprise the Japanese and maybe even hit something.

Next, I'd continue South or Southeast.  Put more space between me and the Japanese.

I know this sounds quite cowardly, but consider this.  First, the Army pursuit squadrons were forbidden from flying more than 15 miles from shore.  No practice means they can't provide CAP.  I'd keep them to CAP the Airfields and maybe fly escort for bombers.

Next, I'd fly the VB and VT squadrons from Enterprise and base them at Ford Island.  I'd keep the VF and VS squadrons to protect the fleet.

With 12 hours notice, the AAF guys should be able to get at least a few more planes operational.  I'd throw all the attack and bomber squadrons at Nagumo, along with VB-6 and VT-6.  My hope?  Bust a deck or two and shoot down as many Japanese planes as possible.  Chances are slim.  After all, B-17s only hit like one warship in the entire war, and I doubt the B-18s would do any better.  They might give the dive bombers of VB-6 a chance to crack a deck, and if we were EXTREMELY lucky, VT-6 might actually get a hit.  After all, the biggest failing of the Mk XIII torpedo was its speed and fragility if launched too high or too fast.  It did not have the exploder problems the sub and surface torpedoes had from what I have read.

The Lexington Group is, in the meantime, steaming Southeast to meet up with the Fleet.

After about 24 hours I'd then bring the fleet Northwest.  Make the rendezvous with Lexington ASAP and maybe look for cripples.  

Yes, I am probably thinking with 20/20 hindsight, but Kimmel would be foolish to try to intercept the Kido Butai.  That would only lead to disaster.


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 Post Number: 22
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PostIcon Posted on: Nov. 07 2008,8:51 Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE


(Desertmole @ Nov. 02 2008,4:57)
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From what I've read over the years, it would take longer than 2 hours to get up steam and be away.  So the question is how much time?

If it were, say, 12 hours, I'd take the fleet to sea and send them South.  After that, work on arranging a rendezous with Halsey.  At least then you have some limited air cover.

I would launch every available PBY in a night attack.  They just might surprise the Japanese and maybe even hit something.

Next, I'd continue South or Southeast.  Put more space between me and the Japanese.

I know this sounds quite cowardly, but consider this.  First, the Army pursuit squadrons were forbidden from flying more than 15 miles from shore.  No practice means they can't provide CAP.  I'd keep them to CAP the Airfields and maybe fly escort for bombers.

Next, I'd fly the VB and VT squadrons from Enterprise and base them at Ford Island.  I'd keep the VF and VS squadrons to protect the fleet.

With 12 hours notice, the AAF guys should be able to get at least a few more planes operational.  I'd throw all the attack and bomber squadrons at Nagumo, along with VB-6 and VT-6.  My hope?  Bust a deck or two and shoot down as many Japanese planes as possible.  Chances are slim.  After all, B-17s only hit like one warship in the entire war, and I doubt the B-18s would do any better.  They might give the dive bombers of VB-6 a chance to crack a deck, and if we were EXTREMELY lucky, VT-6 might actually get a hit.  After all, the biggest failing of the Mk XIII torpedo was its speed and fragility if launched too high or too fast.  It did not have the exploder problems the sub and surface torpedoes had from what I have read.

The Lexington Group is, in the meantime, steaming Southeast to meet up with the Fleet.

After about 24 hours I'd then bring the fleet Northwest.  Make the rendezvous with Lexington ASAP and maybe look for cripples.  

Yes, I am probably thinking with 20/20 hindsight, but Kimmel would be foolish to try to intercept the Kido Butai.  That would only lead to disaster.

It took about 2 to 2-1/2 hours for a pre-WWII battleship to get up enough steam to manuver.  There were no US Aircraft Carriers nearby.  Halsey's Task Force was some 200 miles from PH,  low on fuel and needing provisions.  Newton's Lexington Task Force was about 450 nautical miles from Midway on 7 December and would be unable to render any assistance for a number of days.

Midway through the Japanese air attack, the Battleship Sortie Order was revoked, not that they were going anywhere anyway.
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PostIcon Posted on: Jan. 25 2009,7:56 Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Although Kimmel said that he would have sortied his fleet had he received 2 hours warning notice, the reason that the battleships were in Pearl Harbor that Sunday morning was because the carriers Lexington and Enterprise were out making aircraft deliveries to Midway and Wake Islands.  Kimmel's Pacific Fleet SOP was that whenever the carriers were unavailable, then the BB's were in port.

Even one hour's warning would have been more than enough time to get a number of Army, Navy and Marine Corps fighter planes armed, fueled and aloft, while getting the fleet into an acceptable level of GQ readiness and most importantly, gain "Condition Zed" water tight integrity.
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PostIcon Posted on: Jan. 05 2010,12:37 Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Depends-with 2 Hour warning-sortie all ships out to sea.
Anything less than that -put enough steam in the battleships so their guns can be used as anti-aircraft batteries
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Larry J Search for posts by this member.

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PostIcon Posted on: Jan. 05 2010,12:48 Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Most of them were supplying their own steam anyway, IIRC. Getting the DDs ready to fight would have been crucial. They had the best 5" guns and smaller AAA. As they were anchored out they had one boiler apiece going, so they could have powered guns with no problem. And the pit snipes would have been doing miracles to get the rest of the boilers lit off.

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"Sunday's horoscope is note worthy because of its strange, sudden and wholly unpredictable and inexplicable occurrences, affecting all phases of life." Your Horoscope" L.A. Evening Herald Express, Sat, 12/06/41
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 Post Number: 26
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PostIcon Posted on: Jan. 05 2010,1:35 Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

related link http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtop....343783c
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 Post Number: 27
Larry J Search for posts by this member.

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PostIcon Posted on: Jan. 05 2010,1:42 Skip to the previous post in this topic.  Ignore posts   QUOTE


(PPP @ Jan. 05 2010,11:35)
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That's a long thread.  Anyway, the initial premise needs sourcing. Did anyone say where the Yamamoto information came from? As I understand it, the Imperial Headquarters allowed the attack on Pearl to proceed as long as the southward advance wasn't interfered with. So the idea that there would be an invasion of Hawaii has some problems.

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"Sunday's horoscope is note worthy because of its strange, sudden and wholly unpredictable and inexplicable occurrences, affecting all phases of life." Your Horoscope" L.A. Evening Herald Express, Sat, 12/06/41
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